Off shoot to "why" (a discussion about vintage kart events and ideas going forward)

[johnnyrocket temporary one month membership. member needs to add real name to membership to become full member. contact administrator for help]

I would like to introduce myself as I am totally new to kartting, I had a kart as a youngster and actually watched the races out in Westhampton on Long Island wanting to be like those kids.  I am now 47 and for the past 15 years or so have been trying to do all of the thing's that I dreamed about as a kid without the means to do it young.  I am not dead yet so lets do it all, that's how I live my life.  
I think the thread of "why" has become "how", how do we foster the growth of karting?  I was one of the fathers of collecting BMX, I hosted and led events around the country and had a blast doing it, but then it just like kartting seems to have, BMX hit a high point and only the truest stayed true.  The events starting fading, communication lessened and we as a group found other things to do.  But BMX has hit another high point with the older group, reproduction and retro bikes.  Guys are buying the next cool thing, getting together to casually ride, trading and buying stuff on forums.  I will tell you that I am a big car guy and the custodian at my school is as well.  As soon as I found vintage karting I showed him some pics and he was in.  But he does not want to restore or buy a finished kart, he found "go kart alley" and was like dude can we build our own kart and race it from this kit?  Old school inspired looks.  Is that a direction you should look at as a new focus for karting, would someone build there own and then find an appreciation of the past and say maybe I need some an old karts as well.  So is a retro class necessary to foster the growth of the vintage?  Cheap and easy to start out in.  
On a final thought for now, the group you need to target has a wife and family, committing to a three day go kart event is a big commitment, making it a one day event would be much easier and affordable for them to participate in. Hope I did not insult anyone just a beginners point of view

[steve welte]

I get it you are new. Not every event is 3 days. Some are 2. We have local events in the Midwest we attend that are 1 for fun days. also every 3 day event that I know of, you can come and run 1 day or more. There is a practice only fee. Before you decide to build your own kart and race it be sure you understand the guidelines to doing that. Step back and get things in order. I for one manufacture our own race karts. You can find them in the "build off " section of the forum. So much to learn and digest. What could go wrong. It's just a simple go kart.

[Al Postiglione]

Hello Johnny Rocket......
Vintage Karting is many different things to many different people. For however many people you ask you will probably get as many different answers.

For me it is nostalgia, history, and a recreation of a time long gone by. Hence the Name "Vintage Karting". Part of what I and many others do, is try to preserve the History of this great sport. Unfortunately, as we try to reinvent ourselves in the name of growth, particularly by bending guidelines concerning equipment, the farther away we get from these principles.

In the name of growth, in my opinion, we can not and should not open things up to the point where the equipment is actually modern but just disguised to look vintage. Yes it could be fun for many. Yes it could open the door to many more participants, but it would be far from actually displaying or running anything even close to what actually was.  Remember the name is "Vintage Karting" not Retro-Mod Karting".

As it is now, we are starting to lose a grip on what is actual history and what is not. The more the rules are bent to accommodate, the more the lines between fact and fiction become blur.

We can make things more attractive to new karters by creating events that will satisfy the different factions involved within the one sport of Vintage Karting. Tier I, Tier II, and a greater focus on the shows can certainly help. In the NE, and I'm sure elsewhere, we are focusing on such events.

Also you mention the 2 and 3 day event as expensive. Well, that is true but the distance that most need to travel to get to these events almost demands it. Actually that is not completely true. Anyone can choose to attend one day only. Have a whole lot of fun and turn around and drive home. The amount of track time at most events per day make this a very viable option. I had to do it once this year and still had a ball.  

All of the events that are involved in the NE Promoters Cup Series have been and are still scheduled for only two days. Most, I believe, have over night parking.  All have a full day of practice, kart show and picnic on the first day, followed by more practice and a racing schedule on the second. You see, it's up to you, stay as long or as little as you like. Either way, you're going to have a lot of fun.

As far as one day events go, they can be created on the local level. In the N.E. at the Oreville Track in PA., they have a karting program that welcomes Vintage Karts at all their modern events. Out on Long Island where you and I live, we are trying to get something similar going. We aren't there yet but I am hopeful it will happen. Hopefully soon.

Start prepping that kart you just picked up. Get out to the track. Run it and show it. The growing of the sport will happen. Just think..... You're already considering getting another!

-Al

[David Luciani]

this is a cool thread.

i edited the thread title so other know what's being discussed.

i'm not gonna comment besides encouraging everyone to make a comment.

i'll be reading this daily and just sit in as the admin.
keeping it about the ideas not people is all i'm gonna ask.

and please nothing mean or nasty.

Save

[johnnyrocket temporary one month membership. member needs to add real name to membership to become full member. contact administrator for help]

I get it you are new. Not every event is 3 days. Some are 2. We have local events in the Midwest we attend that are 1 for fun days. also every 3 day event that I know of, you can come and run 1 day or more. There is a practice only fee. Before you decide to build your own kart and race it be sure you understand the guidelines to doing that. Step back and get things in order. I for one manufacture our own race karts. You can find them in the "build off " section of the forum. So much to learn and digest. What could go wrong. It's just a simple go kart.

Steve
I mean absolutely no disrespect to the difficulty of fabrication of a go kart, bending up and welding a chassis should absolutely be left to the professionals.  But to buy a kit that you could paint yourself, pick your wheels, add stickers, and assemble yourself is fun for guys with general not professional mechanical skills.  I know that when we did the vintage BMX hobby and I am sorry for comparing the two hobbies again.  We in the beginning were totally against letting in "retro" but when we finally accepted it company's like SE racing, Hutch, Skyway made the products and the money.  And then we as a group made it a separate class at the shows and races and now it 5 years later it has really taken off.  I know there has to be guys into vintage but are intimidated by the mechanical difficulties of finding and restoring an old kart, if the retro kits were readily availiable I could sell 3-5 tomorrow to me and my buddies.  Mix us in on your events and you have a whole new group, then with a beginners experience they will build the knowledge to the restoration process.

[ted johnson]

Anyone is welcome to design and build their own kart. Just remember that it must appear vintage, must have dimensions and configuration similar to what a kart made in the "day" would have had, must conform to all safety regulations, just as it would have had to do had it been made in the early days, and must have the proper tires and wheels. In order to run in most vintage events, it must have a vintage 2 cycle engine, as well as a clutch and exhaust system that conform to the rules set forth by the event organizer. If someone shows up with a kart made of gas pipe, with lawn mower wheels and a four cycle engine, He will be sent back home. The safety of the other participants depends upon all karts being able to pass technical inspection. Home designs and constructions are welcome! I have three vintage karts. One of these is a close repop of a kart built in Indiana in the early sixties, one is a "standoff" repop of an Ohio built machine, and one is a design strictly out of the collective heads of Pruit Ginsberg and myself. The newest kart still looks vintage, still is built of proper materials, has a vintage two cycle engine, vintage wheels and the proper hard compound tires with "square" edges. I'm certain that it will be welcome at any vintage event. Also remember that all your safety equipment must conform to event regulations. Anyone is welcome to run as many or as few days of an event as he wishes, and most events charge according to the number of days you run. A major portion of the fees goes to pay for insurance, and another large portion usually goes to track rental fees. New participants are always welcomed, but the tech and safety rules will not be bypassed just to entice new karters. Ted
P.S. There are currently no kart kits on the market that will meet the safety regs to run at an organized event.

[Mel Ruffner]

Hi everyone ,great thread and I,am also new this year to vintage karting. I,am a lot older than a lot of you [67] so my views maybe a little different. I use to race karts back in the late seventy,s and had the best time, but family and working made me give it up a few years later. One boring night early this year I was on the computer and just happen to look up karting and came across a  vintage kart site and that stroked my interest. What I like about vintage karting is I can have fun i repeat that, having fun and I don,t care if I finish last. i like tinkering with a old kart and turning laps with out having to buy the latest speed stuff or tires every other race.I only got to run one event this year and maybe 5 or 6 next year.I met the nicest people and would go out of there way to help me and anyone else. they are great people and as long as we have people like them vintage karting is so much better. If any of you have a question  on vintage karting, please ask  on this or any forum and someone will have the answer.So my take on vintage karting is having fun getting to know so many nice people ,keeping it vintage as some of the old karts should have slower motors, cause skinny tires and old brakes can make it dangerous if you give it to much motor.Mostly I will probaly   just go one day to the events, don,t want to get the wife to mad. At first when I told my wife I was thinking about getting a kart she ask if i lost my mind and do you know how old you are, but having seen all the different ages in vintage karting shes find with it.

[Tom Day]

There are plenty of  karts out there that can be bought for less than you can build one and be better unless you are an expert on the process like Steve Welte, By the time you buy all the parts it will cost you more. My advice is to go to some events and talk to the vintage guys about their karts then decide what you want to do. Get on the Vintage Karting Association web site and make a copy of the guidelines and classes then you will be able to make better choices on what you need to ask and what classes you are interested in.

[steve miller]

listen to these guys ..they know whats going on ..
im by far a pro builder or driver .,but I  scratch built these ..less than 500.00 invested ..in each and I turned a lot of laps on them the red one I rode every event I been to in last 4 years not a ton of events but a ton of laps ..
I will say I did lotta wheelin and dealin to get everything.. but I did hundred percent of the work myself ..paint ., fab ., seat all way to complete ..
   
   
   

[steve miller]

we have bmx bikes in barn ..my mint 1980 red line mxIII is in there but my younger brothers have whole bunch
I just turn 56 the other day when my back don't hurt I ride stolen matte black 2015 casino ..